An ominous warning from Andreas’ London Real talk.


  1. thbt101


    Sure, but if Libra does well, it could be the thing that makes cryptocurrency understandable and acceptable by the masses because more people trust Facebook than crypto at this point (sorry guys). I may not use it personally, but I’m rooting for it to succeed, at least for a while.

    Libra already ignited investor interest in crypto again that propelled us finally back above $10k bitcoin prices. That’s definitely already a nice perk of having Libra around.

  2. Likewise, everytime you use a privacy oriented coin you are moving the pendulum closer to democracy and freedom. For that reason, I typically put my fiat into coins that offer true privacy and decentralization. Further, I don’t think that any sort of maximalism should be present since all privacy coins, as small and meager as some are, are part of that movement.

  3. hallucinoglyph


    Every time a transaction is verified on the Libra blockchain, a baby red panda is forced through a wood chipper. Think about that the next time you want to use your convenient, cute-wildlife slaying surveillance coin!!

  4. TI-IC


    Loved that interview, I’ve been writing down some important quotes myself.

    “Money expresses value, especially the value of human time”

    “Is this worth enough of the time value I’ve put into work today? Do I want it enough? Do I value it enough?”

  5. The obvious question here should lead to a question regarding bitcoin and Lightning’s privacy. In terms of the scale of privacy, Bitcoin is better than Libra, but not much. In its current state, unless you do an excellent job of managing keys and at op sec(most don’t) most people could be deanonymized with a single bitcoin transaction to or from the wrong party.

    Unless for every new bitcoin you acquire you are creating a new address, which presents its own management risks, and are very particular about not letting that money commingle with other bitcoin you’ve received.

    This becomes more and more of a risk as time goes on and chain analysis becomes more sophisticated.

    Right now to my knowledge, the best privacy solution on Bitcoin (wasabi) requires owning at least $1000 worth of BTC to transact. Basically just privacy for the rich. This is a good start, but being locked into using certain denominations is cumbersome. Plus mixers presents the risk of coin taint.

    Lightning as a second layer may help add more privacy, but that is still so experimental that it presents its own set of risks for daily private transactions.

    Keep in mind, this privacy stuff is not just a nice thing for commuting crimes it’s also nice for not letting your landlord see your income and charging you higher rent. It’s nice for not letting your employer know you have extra income sources beyond them. It’s nice for companies to not have to worry about competition seeing every transaction. It’s nice for keeping political and charitable donations to yourself.

    Considering all of this, what can we do about privacy in bitcoin? Can we hope that wasabi will add bitcent and smaller transaction sizes? Can we hope for easy XMR atomic swaps (The question then becomes: why even use bitcoin at all, when you could just use XMR?), Will lightning be private enough? Or do we need to advocate for privacy on the Bitcoin base chain?

    As we approach a more and more non private world, and as more and more entities begin to take steps to acquire your data (information is power), more people will ask how to keep their activities private, if we don’t ask how to change this in bitcoin now, either privacy will become a luxury good as bitcoin grows, or a better privacy based currency will usurp bitcoin.

  6. UpstairsAdagio


    Pretty grim coming from the guy who keeps his mouth shut when there is censorship right in front of him and he won’t speak up.
    Andreas is an old time story of Bitcoin.
    He is not relevant anymore.
    He could have been, but he was too much of a coward to walk the walk like he talks the talk

    Every time I see an upvote for him I hear a ding ding that is a little piece of human integrity dying that can never be reclaimed

  7. As a child I rebel’ed because my mind had not yet developed and the only thing I knew was what was “cool” and what the art’s, media and entertainment would allow… We knew what was “best.”


    But as I’ve gotten older and had access to information at my finger tips that allowed me research both side of a controversial topic I began to think…


    Im not a criminal but more camera would’ve stop my car from getting keyed and suck up at gun point…


    More cameras would have stoped the fraud that I experienced as a person feigned me hitting him with my car…


    More camera’s would’ve prevented fraud to prevent my insurance premium going thought the roof over the past 30 to 40 years…


    More “big brother” as we used to call it and rebel against in our youth seems to be more attractive as I get older and don’t rely on what my @#$@ peers think.


    Cookies already hoover up all data about you so they can hopefully sell a product to you…. So what. I’ve already know the difference between the best and the best known… People with no mind will scatter like ant’s and express fear. Andreas is just the other side of the coin.


    It’s not the sound of “Democracy dying” as he so flowery puts it. On the contrary it’s the next step in social evolution. The imagined world of Star Trek would be quit scary to AA it seems as the same principals in the make believe world would be present in this new future… We’re at the door step and have not even entered the house and AA is fearfully saying, “No, don’t go in!!” I wan’t to check it out…

  8. Libra is merely a system meant for people wishing to trade on Facebook itself. These are predominantly advertisers but the second-hand marketplace is taking off as well so they’re trying to become the next eBay.

    By crypto-standards it’s a shitcoin but it has a proper use case and if anything it raises awareness about digital currencies for the mainstream.

  9. Isn’t it bad enough that it’s just a transaction fee vehicle for the companies starting it? I don’t see wtf it does aside from be a middleman. Not to mention the immediately closed ecosystem it creates among the networks of the founding companies. Even calling it Crypto is just branding.

  10. Toyake


    This is inevitable with any public blockchain. Having a publicly recorded history of all transactions mean that companies can do the same thing with bitcoin as they can with Libra.

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